I saunter into the room, just a wee bit late to the party.

[rose_griffes]

Hi! Remember how I said I wasn't going to make a post about the Battlestar Galactica show finale because 12,000 words of fic totally counted as episode analysis? Um... I lied.

First off, everything indented is what I wrote less than a week after the finale aired. Before Fic of DOOOOM took over for a while.

Jacob over at Television Without Pity has proven yet again he's completely crazy got some interesting ideas. I realize that my general enjoyment (with moments of giggling over the weirdness) of the final episode is not shared by everyone, but he gave the episode an F. The other eight episodes listed on the 'front page' of his BSG reviews received A's. All of them. Even 'Deadlock.' And now suddenly he's giving the finale an F?!? Oooooookay. Enjoyable or not, I don't think the quality changed that drastically. (I'd probably give it a B. And a similar grade to a lot of other episodes from season 4.5, though 'Deadlock' would be a lot lower.)

eta: Hah, I just went back and checked. He's changed his grade from an F to a C. But it used to be an F, really!

The actual ending on our Earth: Was anyone else reminded of Angel, season five? The debate about caveman versus astronaut... because cavemen is going to win, since in this scenario, the astronauts gave up their weapons (technology).

Especially with the survivors in the fleet spreading out all over different continents. I think it's safe to say that they all die out except those who manage to mix in with the indigenous pre-verbal peoples in Africa.

That being said... I can easily ignore it because they'll make it a few generations, and then the characters I liked most won't be around by then, so whatever! It's all okay for fanfic for the characters I knew, lalalalalalalalalalala. *sticks fingers in ears*

(I'm also using this technique about cylon/human reproduction. I got babies planned for fic! And semi-scientific reasons about why it didn't work earlier, except for magical Mitochondrial Eve Hera.)

CHARACTERS
Sam: When I finally had to accept that Sam was now a ship's hybrid, I wanted only one thing--for him not to end up that way forever. The show gave me that. Plus we had that brief moment of semi-lucidity when he says goodbye to Kara. It was more than I was expecting to get.

Even though I resented Sam becoming a hybrid, I can deal with it now. He was able to do some essential tasks. It still sort of breaks my heart, but I'll get by.

Kara: The Spoiler from Portland was what had me convinced that Kara would die in the finale. Of course, 'die' is a bit misleading, but... I was more able to accept that plot twist because of it. No way I was going to believe that Kara and Sam would live happily ever after. I'd already figured that Sam was doomed, so it meant that Kara was, too. (Normally I stay unspoiled for BSG, but this one had people in such an uproar. Due to the people and comms who were posting about it, I had pretty much figured out what the spoiler was anyway.)

Her being an angel since her reappearance is not what I expected, but it does fit. I find it makes me resent 'Maelstrom' more than I did when it was first broadcast, oddly enough. Why did she have to go through so much? Kara the human and Kara the angel--neither one received much peace while in corporeal form.

I've been wondering: the song she 'remembers' her dad playing... was that really part of her memories, or were those memories put there to give her the clues to Earth?

Lee: Ah, Lee. I firmly believe that Lee Adama will be okay. He's a resilient, clever man. But why was it him who was always left alone? Abandoned by his father, left behind (again!) by Kara. I don't feel like the show needed a more shippy Kara/Lee ending, I just wish he'd gotten something more.

Caprica Six and Gaius:

*snickers* Uh, yeah. Sorry, Six and Gaius; that's where I had stopped writing before Rosie Sue/Leoben Fic of DOOOM ate my brain.

The robots are gonna kill us all ending would have been much less irritating without the RDM cameo and extra robot dance scenes. I don't mind the ending but that part wasn't well-executed--unlike lots of other parts of the finale, which I may not have liked but were well-made.

So, back to some of my first reactions. The whole 'spread all over the world' thing--I read somewhere that this was really the only option. That many people trying to do subsistence living will need to avoid concentrating in one area. Makes sense to me.

I'm very curious about how many cylons there are. We never got a number. Presumably enough for one baseship, at any rate. How they mix with the human population will probably vary depending on the group. I can't imagine that those mutineers who survived will be anxious to accept cylons, for example... and this may well lead to their earlier deaths, because with extra strength/endurance/agility, the cylons are going to be very helpful to the humans now.

I'd still give the episode a B. Maybe a B-. (Yes, I can be influenced by other people's opinions.) My emotional reactions are counting more than my intellectual reaction, even now.

Cylon babies: I've been planning to ignore the 'only one cylon hybrid' idea for a while. Mostly because I don't like it and think it's dumb. True love does not equal babies. Scientifically it's hard to justify a single hybrid stance. I could explain the problems in creating hybrids by force with captive New Caprican women because those who were left there had all been exposed to varying amounts of radiation via the nuclear holocaust. I can accept that it's more difficult to reproduce sexually for whatever reason in a body that's been created rather than born. Doesn't mean impossible.

As for Hera's mitochondrial DNA, that's not surprising, and doesn't conflict with my MORE HYBRID BABIES demands. mtDNA is passed from mother to daughter, so other cylons could have reproduced, but not had girls in some generation or another. (Plus any other Eights who had daughters would pass along the same mtDNA.)

Laura Roslin's death wasn't surprising by this point. If I were very fannish about Laura--in particular about her NOT as a love interest for Bill Adama--I would be more upset. Or maybe not; I loved Roslin and didn't like her downward spiral in season 4.5, but it was pretty much done by the finale. At any rate, I understand why a lot of fans of Laura are very displeased with what happened, but it's not limited to this episode...

I don't think the number of deaths of female characters really hit until just recently. Thinking about writing fic made me realize that there aren't that many established females I can use in stories anymore. It's frustrating. Does it bother me within the context of just this episode? Not a lot. For the whole show, yes. In this episode, aside from Kara's 'death' I was most upset with Boomer's end. (Speaking of just the women, because SAAAAM! *wails*) It does convince of John Cavil/One's inherent evil hatred for humanity/the biological cylons, because the sleeper programming itself was the source of most of Boomer's problems, and I firmly believe that Cavil created that sleeper programming.

Tory's death annoyed me, but didn't upset me to the same degree. Galen really needs to reboot his programming get some psychological help, or something. Please, DO go off by yourself. You're in time-out. For a very long time.

Back to Kara. I wasn't sure what I was expecting. I knew that she wasn't a cylon. Her general existence as some sort of angel to lead humanity to a new home does fit into what we've seen on the show in general. daybreak777's Kara posts go into great detail about what was unsatisfying about Kara's ending. I wasn't as unhappy, but I do think that what I wrote up there earlier is true. Why did she have to be so unhappy/unsure of who she was while she was in service of God/the Gods/whatever omnipotent being brought her back?

But her role itself didn't bother me. She came back to bring humanity to an Earth that pointed to the problems inherent to their civilization, then helped lead them to one where they don't have to repeat their same mistakes.

Which is also why the 'Let's give up technology and live on the land!' aspect isn't as bothersome to me, either. As I've said before, the idea of survival in rough conditions is a fascinating theme, so my fic-brain is happy to play with this for a long time. I've already mentioned that it's not ALL Lee's fault so I won't repeat myself there.

I can't remember who I said this to, or where, but it went something like this: I really, really wanted the fleet to get to a planet. So it's my Earth, great! Not my 'when' but I can work with this! I think this went a long way to making the finale palatable to me. (Hah, found it here, replying to prolix_allie.)

Also, Tory didn't get away without consequences for killing Cally, Chief really did love his wife (even though he needs serious help), Lee gets to go hike mountains like the boy scout he is, Helo will father more adorable daughters just because I say so, and Twos everywhere will have the dubious pleasure of figuring out how to act like real boys now that they're living with the humans all the time. And the evil, bad cylons are dead and Ellen and Saul will have to figure out how to ferment things again to make liquor, and Sixes will go hunt stuff and be generally terrifying awesome and the Eights will probably have their hearts broken repeatedly, but they'll get over it someday.
and they all die of syphilis because there aren't any condoms or antibiotics

The End

I'm actually slightly more optimistic about their chances of survival over the long term than I was early on. Lots of people will still die, but enough will live on... we're fragile but also resilient.

I think I had other things to say, but my brain has run out of words. Maybe I'll make another post in a few months. Just what everyone wants, heh!

selenak has a mostly-positive write-up here.

Y'ALL. I WANT TO SEE THE LOST SEASON FINALE RIGHT NOW! I HATE THIS WAITING UNTIL THE NEXT DAY!

Comments

[nicole-anell.livejournal.com]

*hearts your review*

He's changed his grade from an F to a C. But it used to be an F, really!
I did see that F, and I thought it was hucking filarious. Two words, Jacob: MODERATE OPINIONS. Check 'em out, they'll change your life.

On Cavemen vs. Astronauts: The depressing Whedon answer was that cavemen always win. Magic, Earth, primal forces over science and safe houses. BSG kind of... oddly embraced that? I don't know if they meant to.

But I think it was you who wrote before about the human race being en route to devolving and losing all their technology anyway. New Caprica was not a thriving city. Galactica was coming apart. *One last tube of toothpaste in the universe*. In that context, Lee's call was drastic, but it wasn't as drastic as some viewers are making it out to be.

I find it makes me resent 'Maelstrom' more than I did when it was first broadcast, oddly enough.
Kara is the one thing in the finale I really haven't processed my own feelings on at all. I didn't necessarily like or dislike it. I think the way it was done and the ambiguity of what she was (yeah, an angel, but HUH? WHO? HOW?) was powerful, yet it also makes me feel a little cheated. Through "Maelstrom" and season four, we watched her struggle for answers. When she left, it still seemed like she didn't know any more than we did.

I'm very curious about how many cylons there are. We never got a number.
I'm so glad I'm not the only one wondering about that! Were they about as many as the humans or significantly less? I remember thinking that's the ONE thing I would've liked to ask RDM during season four. (Uh, my priorities are not other people's priorities.)

Believe me, I'm devastated you have no thoughts on Caprica and Gaius, but I'm just gonna watch their last scene seven more times and get over it.

[sabaceanbabe.livejournal.com]

You know, your POV characters really do seem to have a LOT to do with whether you liked the finale or not. Helo lived. The man who was supposed to die in the first half of the miniseries and who didn't even have a name, went on to be one of the few survivors of the entire series. And while Kara went poof and Sam flew into the sun, they still established that they truly loved each other and they got a kind of closure. And thus I can live with the whole package without being too bitter about the things I didn't like.

I hadn't thought about the fact that any female child in an unbroken line from an Eight would have that mitochondrial DNA, not just Hera. Thank you for that.

I

[daybreak777.livejournal.com]

I agree with the above comment. As much as I say I care about the other characters, I did care more about my top four. Kara, Felix, Lee and Laura. And heck, they were kind of important this season! So it's hard to be happy with the finale (or the show as a whole maybe? I don't think that's me, though) if their ends don't make sense to me.

I was just thinking about Leoben. I don't know Leoben as well as you do and never will. But there is a part of me that is totally pissed about how he ended here! This guy was almost a prophet in Flesh and Bone. He knew about Kobol! He knew about Kara. It was all creepy and mystical and stuff. But he didn't know about Kara, I guess. Season 4 really took away a lot of what I was interested in with Leoben. Not just his connection to Kara but who I thought he was. But hey, I didn't know him that well so maybe I was wrong all along. :-) But if he were a favorite of mine, I would not be happy with all the times CKR was credited only to be given the occasional throwaway line. It's like he from prophet to radio repair guy. But I'm not bitter! Not really, he's not a favorite or mine.

Your reaction to BSG has always been more milder than mine, I think. I know you love the show but I let myself get emotional about it because that was fun for me. All the angst and squee. You also are more focused with writing fic about the show than I am. I watched the show mostly for the show. I really didn't watch it thinking about where I could go with writing stories about it. I wasn't (and am still not) sure if I would continue writing BSG stories after its end. I wondered about this for the last few years, finale aside. But maybe stories are your way of meta and processing, I suppose.

I read somewhere that this was really the only option. That many people trying to do subsistence living will need to avoid concentrating in one area.
Why would people spreading out be more helpful than them all banding together and learning from each other for a few years and then spreading out? Doc Cottle alone could at least train some people if he hadn't already. I feel they were all so vulnerable and unprepared for this. Like the Pilgrims at Plymouth, I feel their numbers would be severely decimated if not wiped out in the beginning, warm climate or not.

I was most upset with Boomer's end.
Yeah? Why? I'm just not sure where she was going to go. After everything that she'd been through it would have been anticlimatic for her to live happily ever after, no? One of the main themes was that the humans were never going to accept her because of what she did. But then if they did accept her eventually, what would that say about that sleeper programming? Actually, how come no one else was a sleeper except for Boomer? Not Caprica or D'Anna or any of them. Boomer got a raw deal there. I tell you if I was her, I would have asked Ellen and Cavil several questions about my creation before I fulfilled my role with them.

Please, DO go off by yourself. You're in time-out.
Hee! You are such a good and compassionate teacher. Time out! Or founding Greenland/Sweden/Norway/Ireland or something.

Why did she have to be so unhappy/unsure of who she was while she was in service of God/the Gods/whatever omnipotent being brought her back?
According to comments to my post? NO NARRATIVE REASON WHATSOEVER. At least none that anyone has explained to me. It would have been so interesting if she had known. Maybe I'll work with that in a fic. Maybe not. :-)

II

[daybreak777.livejournal.com]

Which is also why the 'Let's give up technology and live on the land!' aspect isn't as bothersome to me, either.
It just didn't seem very Lee-like to me. Not a bad idea and it's an interesting point you and nicole_anell make about the New Caprica colony not being viable. I think I didn't realized it at the time but I don't think I ever believed that they'd ever survive on any planet. I still don't. I don't think of the colonists as 'us'. Nope. I think that some people may have dropped themselves here 150,000 years ago but they all died except for a little girl that 'we' adopted and now she's apart of us. I'm good with Hera. Yes, I think of 'us' as those primitive peoples. Yes, they will totally WIN. They should win. Evolution deems it so.

I should mention I have no scientific basis for believing this. It was just my impression when watching. I'm no scientist!

You know who I've missed lately? Especially after watching the fan re-edit? Sammy. I do! I was trying to deny I liked him that much but I do miss him. Somehow he grew on me, sigh. I missed having him be coherent and alive. I missed the potential of who he might have been when he was aphasic. I miss that of them all, you know? Such potential lost! Kara could had done or been anything she wanted. I miss her having a choice. Lee who used to believe in civilization and the law. Where did that all go? I miss him being the fleet's conscience. I miss the idea of Leoben knowing mysterious things and being this scary mad prophet whom you can't ignore. All of them had something. That's why Gaius' journey is so satisfying. Gaius reached his potential. It was a truly touching and lovely moment. I'd watch it again and again but it makes me sad because he's the only one who got that. I'm not sure what to say about Caprica. I like her but I don't think I truly got her voice in the text.

Heh, I guess that's the kind of teacher I'd be. I'm always pushing for more. In myself, in the show. This show overall was fine. There were times of true, true brilliance on BSG, in my opinion. Not just a good show and not just great, but brilliant!!! I can still see those moments. I still love those moments. The finale hasn't worn them dull, thank goodness. But it did not end on brilliance for me and that's really too bad.

I think I give the show over all a B. (B- on the days I remember I don't know who the hell Kara is in early seasons, given info from the finale. If I block that out, I'm okay. But it's hard.) The final exam was a D- sorry. Poor show had been doing so well, went in at a A-. (I'm a tough grader and there's no curve. :-)) Maybe like, Jacob, in time I'll give the final exam less weight. But not today.

I'm sooooo glad you posted your thoughts! They shouldn't have been surprising to me but they are. I like discussing! And I like pretending to be a teacher. :-)

And oh, yes, me with the rambly. Let me know if you want me to stop rambling about the finale all over your journal. I know some people are tired of talking about it but apparently that's not me for now.

[ubiquirk.livejournal.com]

I'm still deciding about Kara. It may take a series rewatch.

But I'm definitely upset that both strong human women 'died,' even though I cerebrally understand both deaths.

I completely agree that them giving up technology wasn't that big of a shock or horror - they pretty much had to with everything falling apart.

YES. I still hate the dorky robot vids at the end.