rose_griffes | TV: power-flipping and that cylon I like

So this bsg_epics post about writing what squicks you (member-locked) in combination with Deborah's latest post-finale Kara/Leoben story The Two Magicians reminded me of a conclusion I reached a while ago but never mentioned here. (And then I forgot about it. But then I remembered again!)

I am the Cylon Slayer. Er, that is, I neutralize the threat of the Twos. I defang them, you might say. Nearly any story of mine that involves Leoben or any other Two in a romantic relationship includes some way that the power has been flipped; he's not the one in control. It started with that very first fic, Prophecy, in which Kara (on our Earth) knows who/what the sleeper Two is, and Leoben is clueless. Mostly.

My post-finale fics definitely have defanged Twos. Settlement and the other two stories have Mark, a Two who's trying to atone (unsuccessfully, because it's impossible) for what the Cylon have done; this leaves Laine (human) with the agency to act in their relationship.

Want to Remember has a non-defanged Leoben, but he's not near enough to Kara to do any harm. Also, he gets to ~~make out with~~ share projections with Caprica Six, who doesn't need the Twos to be defanged to deal with them. (Even though Leoben couldn't do anything to Kara at this point in the show's chronology, this story still freaked me out to write. I loved it once I finished, but it was so creepy to be in that headspace for weeks.)

Nemesis doesn't fit the pattern, but the Two in it is trying very hard to be human in Jean's eyes, because he has ulterior motives. (He's not very good at that whole being a normal human thing.) That pair doesn't ever move beyond a situational friendship anyway, in spite of Two's intentions.

Possibly related, I have a nice little collection of stories mocking Leoben/Twos. Humor is functionally another effective way to take away some of their power. Like a Bad Fairytale puts a Two in a relationship with Tory Foster, who is quite scary enough to deal with the Two's creepiness. Red Pants makes the Twos wrestle over clothing to impress Kara. (I have some other stories out there of various size and silliness.)

Anyway, yeah. That was my big realization that I had some time ago and forgot about again. ~~I like the Twos under my control.~~ I can root for Twos with others in my fic as long as there's not that big power imbalance in their favor.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

That's interesting! And you're right- your Twos don't make me run screaming for the hills.

I've always assumed I've just got an issue with the Two that likes tormenting Kara, and that it's one specific Two that does that. I always liked goateed!Two from your icon :) I have a tough time with Kara/Two, but make it clear it's not the Two obsessed with Kara and I'm okay.

Edited 2011-05-06 00:32 (UTC)

...make it clear it's not the Two obsessed with Kara and I'm okay.

I really disliked it when the show made it canon that all the Twos had some kind of thing about Kara Thrace. But it's easy enough to say that only Leoben took it too far. (And since she really was that important to the plan, it would only make sense that a cylon copy with some sort of gift for prophecy/visions would find Kara interesting.)

I'm sort of amused at my brain for doing all this power-stripping subconsciously. Thanks, brain, for finding me safe ways to feel sort of shippy about Two/a human! ;-)

Interesting!

Do you think you make him less powerful for his benefit (because you think it does him good to be less powerful) or for his partner's benefit (because you think he's a better partner/friend/whatever that way)? I can definitely see both. Your 'Prophecy' Leoben definitely became a better person after becoming less powerful, and his lack of power also made it possible for Kara to take some risks with him.

This post is making me want to get all rambly about Leoben and power and kinds of power that he does and doesn't have...but I should probably do that in my own LJ.

I think 'Written in the Bone' is an interesting example of this...Leoben seems to be the one in power in that story, but really he's powerless in the face of both their histories.

I think 'Written in the Bone' is an interesting example of this...Leoben seems to be the one in power in that story, but really he's powerless in the face of both their histories.

Powerless but not defanged, maybe? Because although he acts like he has to be that way, he was still taking away Kara's agency. Hmmmm...

Do you think you make him less powerful for his benefit (because you think it does him good to be less powerful) or for his partner's benefit (because you think he's a better partner/friend/whatever that way)? I can definitely see both.

Yes to both. Though with Prophecy-Leoben, it wasn't as much of a choice as with post-finale Mark, who deliberately chose a path that led away from who/what he had been in the past. So he has more agency than sleeper Leoben. (I do think that taking away the memories of that history--the cylon enslavement, among other things--would be freeing in a sense, although I wonder if he would voluntarily give that up?)

Edited 2011-05-07 03:08 (UTC)

I do think that taking away the memories of that history--the cylon enslavement, among other things--would be freeing in a sense, although I wonder if he would voluntarily give that up?

I think that is a very interesting premise for fic. I don't think a Leoben-identified-Leoben would, but a non-Leoben-identified Two might, under the right circumstances.

Hmm. I like Leoben in your fics, but I never thought of him as defanged. I don't mind if he's fanged. Canon demystified him and I was disappointed in that. I've written him very little. Sometimes in one of my stories, he has the power, sometimes not. That was the interesting thing for me about Kara and Leoben. The constant powerplay. I always wanted Kara to win, of course, but for a while there, I was never quite sure. That was interesting to me.

lls_mutant defanged Narcho for me in her fics. I was afraid of most of the Pegasus crew except for Hoshi, Laird and Showboat. Not so much Kendra later though she was scary before we met her. I needed the Pegasus crew defanged to have any sympathy for them and who they became. I totally root for Hoshi and Narch in LLS' fics. I takes a skilled writer to inspire a reaction like that in me.

That was the interesting thing for me about Kara and Leoben. The constant powerplay.

*nods* That's part of why it amuses me to realize how much I took that power away from Leoben when I was feeling the most shippy about him and Kara. Because even though the dynamic was interesting on the show, I couldn't invest in the pair without some confidence that (sleeper) Two was... not the one to keep the control that time.

I needed the Pegasus crew defanged to have any sympathy for them and who they became. I totally root for Hoshi and Narch in LLS' fics. I takes a skilled writer to inspire a reaction like that in me.

Yeah. I don't know that I was scared of the Pegasus crew as a whole; just certain ones. Maybe because I didn't really want to think about the implications of who/what they had become under Caine's rule, except when I was forced to--like with those Sunshine boys. *spits*

But I do love it when a small character gets drawn in finer detail in fic: both to read and to write.

User

deborah_judge referenced to your post from Deleted scene from "The Two Magicians" (http://deborah-judge.livejournal.com/215386.html) saying: [...] the fic was getting too long. Also it's relevant 's comments the other day about Leoben and power [...]

TV: power-flipping and that cylon I like

no subject

no subject

no subject

And...

Re: And...

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

Deleted scene from "The Two Magicians"